YHK - yet another hacker news clone

Ukraine Can't Stop Russia's Jet-Powered Shahed Drone

12 points rbanffy 3 hours ago 15 comments

pjc50 2 hours ago | parent

$100k a drone.

Ukraine needs Patriot or an equivalent air to ground capability, but those are extremely expensive.

It sounds like the prop-driven shaheds were being intercepted with prop-driven drones piloted manually? I suppose that shows the relevant technology for guidance has been kept secret enough that it's not instantly being cloned, or is more expensive than human operators.

NewJazz 2 hours ago | parent

Guidance to hit a stationary target is easier than to hit a moving target. Especially considering the shaheds aren't particularly exact about what stationary target they hit.

leoedin 2 hours ago | parent

It just seems like everyone is re-inventing the tech of the 50s and 60s, but at a fraction of the cost by using a completely different set of parts, supply chains and cost structures. And massive eventual volumes.

My guess is the Ukrainians will put a rocket on their interceptor drones, and develop some sort of radar or heat seeking guidance system. Perhaps we'll end up with an interesting hybrid interceptor missile that uses electric propulsion for part of the journey?

jmpman 1 hour ago | parent

In an economic battle, I continue wondering why Ukraine has interceptors which detonate instead of being armed with projectiles. High speed cameras and low latency bridgewire ignition, coupled with AI targeting should enable single shot targeting with high probability of success. Multiple reusable interceptors seems like a better solution than expendable. At the same build rate, the number of interceptors per incoming drone will grow over time, instead of maintaining equivalence.

m4rtink 1 hour ago | parent

I think the current interceptors are optimized for one way attack - just enough flight time to catch the target and detonate. Any extra systems (such as guns or recovery hardware) make the interceptor more expensive.

Also these kamikaze drones are not flying in huge flocks like WW2 bomber that tried to cover each other with machine guns - even if a gun armed interceptor shoots one down, it might not be able to intercept another during the raid.

Some bigger, L-39 sized jet drones on the other hand could be quite capable, possibly launching separate one-way interceptors on top of guns.

LarsKrimi 6 minutes ago | parent

More moving parts would mean a much more complex system which would heighten maintenance cost and likely lower successful interceptions per working system significantly.

I'm sure the Ukrainians can draw two curves and see where they intercept

wisemanwillhear 3 minutes ago | parent

I've wondered the same thing. After watching the footage of some of these drone intercepts I realized the camera view interceptors are very erratic. My guess is that shooting a drone down from another cheap interceptor drone is just too difficult to do reliably. I understand that the cost of the interceptors are preferable than the cost of letting them hit their targets, and I understand that they are still an order of magnitude cheaper than the long-range Geran drones they are shooting down.

Given that they show footage of men shooting down similar drones from airplanes, perhaps they can eventually build a larger more stable platform with a more reliable aim using projectiles.

sedan_baklazhan 1 hour ago | parent

Drone’s name is Geran-5. It is also made in Russia, not in Iran. Nor does Iran produce such a (or somehow similar) drone. Nor does Iran claim any rights to it.

Calling it Shahed is a very weird propaganda twist.

m4rtink 1 hour ago | parent

Iran does manufacture a lot of drones, including similar looking ones.

sedan_baklazhan 1 hour ago | parent

Just repeating. This drone is named Geran-5. It is produced in Russia. Iran doesn’t produce such a jet drone at all.

Renaming another country’s weapon is a very weird propaganda move. Why would anyone do that?

debugnik 1 hour ago | parent

Good question, why did Russia rename the Shahed-131 to Geran-1? Those are allegedly Iranian made, and Geran-2 is allegedly a slightly modified Shahed-136. Of course, as they keep modifying them they slowly become their own thing, but there's a clear tech ancestry.

m4rtink 1 hour ago | parent

I am not saying this drones is Iran made (it is most likely built by gang pressed teenagers in Alabuga like other Geran drones) just that Iran has a bunch of drone designs, including jet powered ones:

https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2019/09/the-oryx-handbook-of-i...

Also would not be surprised if there was knowledge sharing either previously when their let them clone the main Shahed variant or even to this day.

badRNG 54 minutes ago | parent

"Drone" is an overloaded term. I'm not sure what someone means when they say "drone" (an FPV drone? an MQ-9?) When someone mentions "Shahed" I immediately know what's being talked about. It disambiguates what's being discussed.

Many also describe the US-made LUCAS drone as a Shahed clone, which clear up what role this system fills.

meepmorp 1 hour ago | parent

The original drone design was based on prop driven shaheed drones, which were both supplied directly by Iran as well as being manufactured (and further developed) in Russia.

Calling it a propaganda twist ignores how the thing came to be.