105 points sensanaty 2 hours ago 139 comments
api 1 hour ago | parent
mitxela 1 hour ago | parent
YetAnotherNick 1 hour ago | parent
There will be protests and cases related to water usage of AI, but none of them would hold any ground. And winning the water case would just make the argument in their favour.
DANmode 1 hour ago | parent
> Just few months back
Just a few months more, and the public was still often making Epstein references.
0xbadcafebee 47 minutes ago | parent
rileymat2 10 minutes ago | parent
tptacek 1 hour ago | parent
demibabs 1 hour ago | parent
I think the 13M is referring to “during peak times”, whatever that means.
XMPPwocky 1 hour ago | parent
> However, using a computer cursor to highlight the redacted text box in the report to DWEE, then copying and pasting it into a separate document reveals that *Agate LLC* is reporting 52.65 megawatts of electricity during peak electrical demand and 13.299 megagallons of water between cooling towers, evaporative systems and site operations in the last year. That totals out to 13 million gallons of water.
> For context, 13 million gallons is enough to fill around 20 Olympic-size swimming pools, and is less than half of what the City of Lincoln reports using on Sept. 29.
> The *six* data centers reporting as of Sept. 30 show a total use of 765 million gallons of water last year, enough water to fill 1,159.93 Olympic-size swimming pools.
> More improper redaction shows that the data center using the most water annually is *Fireball Group LLC*, the Google Data Center in Papillion. Fireball LLC reports 547.88 megagallons for their 2025 Annual Water Consumption.
tptacek 1 hour ago | parent
grebc 55 minutes ago | parent
So while pointing to agriculture and saying look there - those guys & gals way more than us it’s a red herring because we need food.
Sure improve efficiency of ag, but a better comp for water usage should be made. Reasonable people tune out.
deckar01 1 hour ago | parent
tptacek 1 hour ago | parent
linsomniac 45 minutes ago | parent
How so? NOT COUNTING leaks and filling, the average Olympic sized swimming pool uses 1-2 million gallons of water a year.
See EPA Commercial Pooland Spa Equipment Best Management Practices for Commercial and Institutional Facilities https://www.epa.gov/system/files/documents/2023-11/ws-commer...
TeMPOraL 31 minutes ago | parent
It's basically like framing power consumption in watt hours. A million watt hours is tiny at any scale, your whole neighborhood uses millions every day.
ordersofmag 16 minutes ago | parent
deckar01 39 minutes ago | parent
dekhn 48 minutes ago | parent
So probably we could grow fewer almonds in California.
AlotOfReading 13 minutes ago | parent
maccard 1 hour ago | parent
mrb 58 minutes ago | parent
The water bill alone would be only $100k/yr assuming average US domestic rate of $8 per 1000 gallons.
gspr 48 minutes ago | parent
TeMPOraL 34 minutes ago | parent
gspr 29 minutes ago | parent
bluecheese452 24 minutes ago | parent
motbus3 47 minutes ago | parent
I think at some point someone used the argument of the spoon of water to say about the quantity, but I remember to see explanations that it was unrelated.
TeMPOraL 28 minutes ago | parent
Part of why construction of such buildings (starting with pursuing and getting a permit for it) takes as long as it does is because those issues are worked out in advance.
Nobody who is responsible for managing water is surprised by data centers appearing, it's not like they just grow overnight after a rain like people believe mushrooms do.
bryzaguy 21 minutes ago | parent
pavel_lishin 1 hour ago | parent
Over the course of a year, that doesn't sound terrible.
persedes 1 hour ago | parent
tptacek 1 hour ago | parent
1-6 1 hour ago | parent
The greener solution is to use water.
XMPPwocky 1 hour ago | parent
fastball 49 minutes ago | parent
ordersofmag 13 minutes ago | parent
aliasxneo 1 hour ago | parent
The current data center craze just feels like the same thing but on a bigger scale.
cyanydeez 1 hour ago | parent
hypfer 56 minutes ago | parent
Not necessarily astroturfed but definitely biased.
gspr 50 minutes ago | parent
Dylan16807 46 minutes ago | parent
williamtell 44 minutes ago | parent
gspr 31 minutes ago | parent
hypfer 19 minutes ago | parent
Written communication is hard
tzs 5 minutes ago | parent
That makes it very clear he was an employee of Google working at the data center.
dotancohen 18 minutes ago | parent
david-gpu 45 minutes ago | parent
hypfer 43 minutes ago | parent
It's not well-paid enough to be immune to kool-aid etc, and it's not on the sociopathic management level either, so we can expect a certain degree of very human rationalization going on.
petergs 35 minutes ago | parent
hypfer 31 minutes ago | parent
It offers the compelling counter-narrative of "yes, we're evil, but hell yeah this is lucrative af". That makes the ego even happier, as in that story, one is the clever mastermind playing the system, so we can reasonably assume that that path will be taken.
If that path is unavailable, and cognitive dissonance sets in, the other path left is actually drinking the kool-aid. The corp must be nice, after all.
(This all assumes that people do in fact want to do good and have a conscience, but for those that doesn't apply to, there's the sociopathy path as mentioned in the previous comment. Reality is slightly more murky and dynamic, but I'd argue that this rough if-ladder exists as described.)
Marha01 34 minutes ago | parent
It is also interesting how much the anti-datacenter panic sounds like astroturf.
bix6 56 minutes ago | parent
fastball 51 minutes ago | parent
collingreen 30 minutes ago | parent
TehCorwiz 18 minutes ago | parent
Are they drawing from a flowing source or an aquifer? Is it depleting a limited resource?
Is it evaporative or does the waste get discharged?
Is the waste water treated for the metal that it leaches from the cooling system?
Is it allowed to reach thermal equilibrium first or is the water discharged warm which can cause algae blooms or other problems?
bix6 28 minutes ago | parent
anigbrowl 47 minutes ago | parent
but trade secrets
I think all data centers and other industrial concerns above a certain size should have to publish that.
bluecheese452 31 minutes ago | parent
WarmWash 23 minutes ago | parent
WarmWash 30 minutes ago | parent
The hysteria always gives datacenter usage numbers in a vacuum, never a comparison, for good reason; we might have to start protesting golf courses and paper mills instead.
jacquesm 16 minutes ago | parent
bix6 25 minutes ago | parent
PunchyHamster 55 minutes ago | parent
Traditional data centers have far smaller power density per rack and thus cooling requirements than AI datacenters; if you can use closed loop system without evaporation, water usage is very small. Difference is around order of magnitude
But if you want to fit maximum amount of compute in the space and need to dissipate it, evaporative based system will be far more effective space wise; especially if also for some reason you built it in hot place, rather than somewhere in the north
michaelt 47 minutes ago | parent
It'd be pretty easy for the company to dispel those outlandish accusations - the PR department could just report the true numbers.
minimaxir 39 minutes ago | parent
Both things happened when Sam Altman blogged about how much water the median ChatGPT query used.
Ancapistani 37 minutes ago | parent
Now that it has been, though…
therealpygon 35 minutes ago | parent
Effectively no reward at any risk level, regardless of whether one agrees if there is actually any risk.
bluealienpie 29 minutes ago | parent
I think the disinformation is people thinking that data centers directly use vast quantities of water. What happens is the power use stresses water supplies in local areas.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jun/08/datacenter-a...
bliteben 27 minutes ago | parent
If they are using over a certain percent of any public utility (and yes ALL utilities are public) the utility should force it to be disclosed.
bix6 20 minutes ago | parent
dekhn 10 minutes ago | parent
They carefully hid things so they could expand for as long as possible, knowing that having the necessary footprint for services, cloud, and AI would be key to winning the race. When I worked at Google, our leaders were always "proud" they had built such a huge fleet (originally for search + ads but rapidly growing to a wide range of products and research) without competitors knowing just how large, because they figured eventually AWS and MSFT would realize they had to build out massively to handle the coming loads.
So they hide these things to stave off complaints for as long as possible.
Eyas 34 minutes ago | parent
bix6 21 minutes ago | parent
Noticeably they initially shared this info and then stopped. It seemed to stop around the time researchers started investigating the projects.
junofan 10 minutes ago | parent
Why not get people riled up over water under the bridge and not unpaid rebates? What can anybody do about it? Send the sheriff to lock out the facility?
bix6 9 minutes ago | parent
jonas21 4 minutes ago | parent
https://sustainability.google/files/1699a2e19277e478b38a659f...
cogman10 12 minutes ago | parent
I get it, a lot of the older data centers consumed relatively little power. More than nothing but manageable like 1 or 2MW.
The reason for the "craze" is that the AI datacenters being built are monstrosities that consume way more power, an order of magnitude or more. And a lot of them are going up.
pj_mukh 7 minutes ago | parent
All this whinging about "is this project using too much power or not" is pointless scarcity that we've chosen to partake in. If we are to create and spend political capital via hyper-focussing on a single issue, perhaps we should use it to fix this instead?
[1]: https://reneweconomy.com.au/just-staggering-china-installs-1...
stogot 5 minutes ago | parent
dylan604 1 hour ago | parent
motionlessveloc 1 hour ago | parent
The one exception is if they're using fossil water pumped from aquifers, which doesn't renew (back into the aquifer that is), but nobody seems to bother to make the distinction.
debatem1 55 minutes ago | parent
blensor 54 minutes ago | parent
Yes water goes eventually back into circulation but that does not help in the place where the system is already at it's limit
bix6 53 minutes ago | parent
0xbadcafebee 51 minutes ago | parent
bix6 36 minutes ago | parent
0xbadcafebee 53 minutes ago | parent
rileymat2 9 minutes ago | parent
eesmith 46 minutes ago | parent
If you pump water out of one watershed into another, perhaps via evaporation and wind transport, then you better expect the downstream users, deprived of their water, to complain.
For example, the upstream users of water from the Colorado use so much that Colorado River Delta is nearly always dry. Or read about the California water wars.
Further, increased competition for surface water raises prices, which encourages additional aquifer extraction.
ordersofmag 9 minutes ago | parent
eleventen 1 hour ago | parent
> Many articles about current or future AI data centers report the number in the water permit they apply for as the amount of water they actually use day to day. But this almost never happens. [1]
This is from the problematic and often wrong but in this case correct Andy Masley. It's not completely clear to me whether this number is observed usage or a theoretical permitted maximum, in which case the actual usage could be even lower. It could be either.
[1] https://blog.andymasley.com/p/the-ai-water-issue-is-fake?ope...
bix6 55 minutes ago | parent
XCabbage 40 minutes ago | parent
eleventen 24 minutes ago | parent
bluecheese452 22 minutes ago | parent
drnick1 1 hour ago | parent
minimaxir 43 minutes ago | parent
alcomatt 27 minutes ago | parent
jimjimjim 43 minutes ago | parent
If it really matters, block it out, print it, scan it, then send that.
If it really really really matters, block it out with random extra amounts of width, print it, scan it, edit the page images in paint to move the text to the right of a redaction forward or back a bit so people can't guess the words based on width.
bluecheese452 39 minutes ago | parent
userbinator 36 minutes ago | parent
devindotcom 26 minutes ago | parent
If those numbers are yearly, they are significant (about what the city of Lincoln uses in a month) but perhaps not troubling. Depends on your perspective.
amelius 20 minutes ago | parent
bryzaguy 17 minutes ago | parent
Wow!
se4u 5 minutes ago | parent
> Data centers impact local utilities unevenly: while their water consumption is roughly equivalent to adding a small town of 25,000 people, their electrical footprint across the state exceeds the residential power needs of the entire population of Nebraska.
> Together, Google’s three Nebraska data center sites draw enough electricity to power up to 290,000 homes—equivalent to supplying the entire residential power grid for roughly one-third of Nebraska’s total population.