48 points lermontov 2 days ago 13 comments
kadw 2 hours ago | parent
yu3zhou4 1 hour ago | parent
keiferski 1 hour ago | parent
unj 1 hour ago | parent
kayo_20211030 1 hour ago | parent
What a great phrase.
epolanski 1 hour ago | parent
I'm Polish, out of my 8 grandfathers: 2 come from modern day central Ukraine (Vinnytsia), 2 come from modern day Belarus (Ashmyany).
It's very hard to explain to people how weak the whole concept of nation state used to be in Eastern Europe till ww2.
From Eastern Germany to the Urals, every place you would go it was a deeply cosmopolitan mix of Germans, Jews, different Slav ethnicities and depending on the regions significant Romanians, Hungarians, Turks and some other minorities.
You would cross from one village to the other and the language would change, and in minor centers neighborhood and districts changed architecture and language. Different ethnicities also generally mapped to different professions and status. And those changes didn't really look like gradients, more like dispersed bubbles.
Ethnic tensions were always present, everybody literally hated and tolerated each other with Jews generally being the common scape goat.
My grandparents coming from modern day Ukraine vividly remember the violence and terror caused by UPA, the nazi-sympathizing Ukrainian militias. My mother's grandma could not forget till the day she lived (died in 2004) what she saw in her childhood village when Ukrainians came and started a massacre that saw her losing a brother, countless cousins, uncles and friends.
Of course, Poles have been the aggressors too, just a few decades before, when Poland attacked the Soviet Union in the 1920s and had its own share of ethnic violence against Ukrainians and Belarusians.
In any case, Eastern Europe is deeply plagued and poisoned by all of this past violence. No one is able to have a mea culpa moment, no one is able to admit their own guys were bloody murders often killing thousands of people like cattle. No one can admit their ancestors crap.
The same happens in the Russo-Ukrainian conflict. The Russians see in Ukrainians the accomplice of their biggest trauma (the Great Patriotic War against Nazi Germany).
The Ukrainians see in Russia the perpetrator of their biggest trauma (the 1920s Holodomor).
No side ever says sorry, no side ever takes responsibility, no side can move on. And Eastern Europe keeps being unhealed from its traumas and carrying this in modern age.
And a man that would rather see the world burn than step out (Putin) plays on those traumas he very well understands for his own personal lust of power.
ecshafer 55 minutes ago | parent
lukaslalinsky 8 minutes ago | parent
rafski123 31 minutes ago | parent
pzo 19 minutes ago | parent
You probably mean great grand parents. You can only have 2 grandfathers.
tuzemec 5 minutes ago | parent
And I feel that the Balkans are even more representative, although my perspective may be skewed because I live there.
yakshaving_jgt 52 minutes ago | parent
As is half of my family, incidentally. In fact, the names of some of my relatives are written on the wall inside the museum pictured in the article. I lived there for 10 years. Lovely place to live.
lifestyleguru 44 minutes ago | parent