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Pentagon grants DHS permission to test heat ray weapon for use at border

32 points bushwart 1 hour ago 31 comments

icegreentea2 1 hour ago | parent

The system in question is basically just a directed microwave emitter. It is designed to heat up the first ~0.5mm of your skin.

It's safety is basically completely a function of the operator. Since the beam will keep depositing energy (ie heating), if the beam is held on a target, it will incur more and more heating (and potentially harm).

In proper usage, safety is ensured through the combination of operator training, selection of proper settings, and induced compliance. If you have a shitty operator, risk of over exposure increases. The nature of this device means that it's not a barrier, it's a beam.

During earlier testing, they were able to induce second degree burns on a test subject due to incorrect power and duration settings.

pstuart 59 minutes ago | parent

There's no way I'd trust this in the hands of anyone, especially those operating in the service of the current administration. They say they want to use it to "protect the border" but there are reports that they'd used it domestically already.

Considering the non-tolerance of public protest and the "promise" of non-lethality, I could imagine this becoming a regular tool in population control if things don't change.

danparsonson 58 minutes ago | parent

...and one need only watch videos of "trained officers" hosing people with pepper spray to envision how that will turn out.

everdrive 53 minutes ago | parent

Also try not to think about contact lenses, piercings, jewelry, pacemakers, etc.

busssard 43 minutes ago | parent

i wonder what would happen if i am wearing a layer of aluminum foil under my shirt...

bijowo1676 21 minutes ago | parent

put it into microwave, aluminum will spark and will burn like the thermite

footy 52 minutes ago | parent

for certain types of tools (and I'd certainly class weapons as this type) you have to assume that a certain number of operators will be, as you put it, "shitty". Whether it's because they're having a bad day, are genuinely incompetent, are malicious, whatever the reason---some percentage of the operators will be using your tool in a way you'd discourage for PR reasons.

Maybe I am too cynical, but I don't think the people making these tools actually care about this either, not beyond the potential for bad publicity.

nonethewiser 19 minutes ago | parent

And as a potential border crosser, better to not risk it.

stvltvs 16 minutes ago | parent

Every individual has their own risk tradeoff calculation. People already risk death to cross the border, so it's not clear how much this would move the needle.

irishcoffee 11 minutes ago | parent

> People already risk death to cross the border

At what percentage would you say? 1%, 3%, 87%?

Does the country they are fleeing have no culpability? Why are they leaving?

hilariously 8 minutes ago | parent

A man runs out of a burning building. You shoot him. Dang, that building really should have had more culpability.

hilariously 8 minutes ago | parent

Most people fleeing across the border have braved significantly worse, this is just another way to harm people we see as lesser for the accident of where they were born.

bijowo1676 47 minutes ago | parent

knowing the kind of people who sign up for ICE/CBP enforcement, I have no hope that a trained or decent operator will be behind this machine.

I expect a lot of severely traumatized people from this device

10111001 41 minutes ago | parent

> The system in question is basically just a directed microwave emitter. It is designed to heat up the first ~0.5mm of your skin.

So what happens when it's shot at someone's eyes?

icegreentea2 37 minutes ago | parent

The innate blink reflex is supposed to be enough to limit risk of damage: https://web.archive.org/web/20130216134111/http://jnlwp.defe... (go to page 14/28).

euroderf 11 minutes ago | parent

So if I can't keep my eyes closed (because of a riot situation, or friends in trouble) am I risking permanent eye damage, with no government responsibility for it, because some cop shouted something into a bullhorn that I couldn't make out ?

pull_my_finger 29 minutes ago | parent

> If you have a shitty operator, risk of over exposure increases.

Good thing border control isn't full of rejects and nonhackers from the military and real law enforcement \s

causesothere 58 minutes ago | parent

This is a weapon that will be deployed primarily against their own citizens.

samudrijan 54 minutes ago | parent

The “border” extends 100 miles in-land from the actual border and encompasses 2/3 of the US population. DHS needs to be dismantled stat.

10111001 38 minutes ago | parent

> The “border” extends 100 miles in-land from the actual border and encompasses 2/3 of the US population. DHS needs to be dismantled stat.

1. How do you get from your first sentence to your second sentence?

2. If you dismantle DHS, what do you propose to replace it with? Will your replacement lead to a landslide MAGA victory in the next election after it's implemented?

VCFundedGenYer 29 minutes ago | parent

You don't seem to be grasping the severity of the situation if all you care about is "what do you want as a replacement?"

gessha 18 minutes ago | parent

Re 2: There’s so many gov agencies with overlapping responsibilities that I’m actually surprised you ask this. You can totally close a number of them and still have a functioning government on paper. Reality might turn out different.

As per your second question, I have no answer. Dems are so dysfunctional it’s beyond parody.

kec 12 minutes ago | parent

DHS was founded in 2003, as was ICE. The country got along for 227 years without these organizations, they aren't some bedrock thing from time immemorial.

Recognizing that the current structure and mode of operation of these organizations is problematic and leading to bad outcomes also doesn't mean flipping to fully open borders with zero law enforcement as some imply every time this is brought up.

mcmcmc 5 minutes ago | parent

[delayed]

nonethewiser 19 minutes ago | parent

At the border?

thunderfork 14 minutes ago | parent

Today, the border; tomorrow, hand-me-downs to every cop shop in the country

footy 56 minutes ago | parent

what the actual fuck.

edit: okay, first reaction, obviously not contributing to any conversation. This is barbaric and if I paid US taxes I'd be writing my government.

igleria 26 minutes ago | parent

Surely the border patrol will not use it to torture a trespasser?

jpmattia 6 minutes ago | parent

And suddenly, there was a market for body-sized Bragg reflectors in the microwave region.