YHK - yet another hacker news clone

29 points khoury 3 days ago 17 comments

I have been running a SaaS for ~10 years used heavily by people 65+ and a lot of them are tired and frustrated about remembering the domain/path to login screen and then which email/password they used, having to go through the whole forgot-password-flow, etc. I have tried simplifying this as much as i can but I feel like there must be better options. Google sigin in is confusing for them because they get thrown into Googles horrible UX flow where they might have multiple accounts and they don't like when the website suddenly changes.

In general, what is the best way to simplify the auth UX for this group of users? Is there any UI libraries out there targeting this group more specifically? Any good web examples you know of?

thx

aarreedd 1 hour ago | parent

Facebook must have optimized for this. Do whatever they do.

And make it so they don't have to log back in frequently.

Gigachad 21 minutes ago | parent

Login is probably the number 1 issue I have seen with old people. They generally have a book of passwords where most of them are simple or reused. And if they get logged out it's a nightmare to get back in.

I'd suggest not having a password at all. Either use SMS/Email codes, or Passkeys.

troymc 1 hour ago | parent

I can relate because my dad is 84 and he really struggles with simple things like entering a password to sign in to Gmail. He forgets what he did last time and so I'm back to explaining how moving his mouse causes the pointy-arrow thing move around on the screen, to get it pointed at the wide rectangle near the middle of the screen, etc. No UI library is going to solve his struggles.

I solved most of the sign-in problem for my dad by picking a simpler browser than Google Chrome, and by tweaking his browser settings to be just-so. That's not going to be much help for you, the website creator...

Maybe allow passkeys for login? These days, passkeys usually get stored/supplied by the underlying OS. (By usually, I mean that's the statistically most common source of the passkey today. They can also come from a browser plugin or a hardware key.)

simonw 1 hour ago | parent

I worry that passkeys are going to confuse the heck out of less technically sophisticated users the moment they hit an edge cases, and I bet they can find edge cases.

doubled112 50 minutes ago | parent

I can't think of any two sites that work the same way once you start using them. It seemed like every service was its own edge case.

rr808 1 hour ago | parent

I quite like the new trend where you can login just by entering the 2fa on SMS or email. Skip the whole username/password.

dewey 59 minutes ago | parent

I really dislike these "magic links" as a login procedure as you always have to switch between apps instead of just filling login / 2FA with your password manager. SMS is even worse as it's also insecure.

As an additional option, I can see the benefit for people who live in their Gmail app and don't have a password manager.

raw_anon_1111 34 minutes ago | parent

On iOS, the code from Messages or email is auto populated. But just don’t do email. Too many things can go wrong.

But I do love pass keys.

lysp 26 minutes ago | parent

The other potential issue is the age of the users.

Magic emails might work for general users, but for an 80yo who struggles using a mouse. Teaching them to click on links in emails is probably not the best practise.

morkalork 25 minutes ago | parent

This is a lame complaint but I hate it just because it will by default open the website in a browser session belonging to the email app when you click the magic link. That extra step of finding the menu and telling it to open the signed-in page in the real chrome instance just grinds my UX gears.

Gigachad 23 minutes ago | parent

Passkeys are even better since you don't have to pull out your phone or switch to email to grab a code. It just logs you in.

Also for old people, its impossible to fall for a phishing page using Passkeys. Unlike auth codes where you can type the code in to a fake login page.

OuterVale 42 minutes ago | parent

A valuable approach is to aim for AAA WCAG conformance. Obviously it isn't a perfect way to go about it and there are other considerations here, but at level AAA you're more likely than not ensuring an extremely clear and usable interface.

kartika36363 33 minutes ago | parent

easiest ui is no ui

wonger_ 28 minutes ago | parent

I like the AAA WCAG recommendation. I'd also recommend from my casual experience listening to lots of old people...

- a large font size by default, and maybe a font size slider on the homepage. Test everything at 200-300% scale as WCAG recommends

- don't change the UI! Or change as little as possible, at least for existing users. Which kinda upturns the whole always-updating nature of web SaaS but I think it can be done

- hire a good designer who can streamline your UX and screens and keep only the bare minimum features

- maybe offer human support? Like a phone number? Probably unreasonable for you tho

Wish I had ideas for simpler login and auth.

Have you found any successful design strategies in your 10 years? Any insights from user testing?

anyfactor 24 minutes ago | parent

I am really interested in the concept of elder/senior citizen technology. The basic design concept for them is answering "what am I looking at?"

I created this tool (https://anftr.com/) for some of my ex-colleagues in their early 50s who were trying to navigate the world of office software. They were struggling with Microsoft Word and Excel, and I have seen them yell at ChatGPT and bash their mouses constantly, hoping the computer will load files faster.

Essentially, you focus on text and video demos. The foundational design concept for elder tech is providing clear instructions and minimizing interactions.

If you want them to sign in, you should not require them to press a button more than two times.

To address things they tend to forget, consider a human custodian or "IT concierge" model, please. The reality is that after a certain age, people really struggle to learn new things and prefer talking to a person for help. Technology has its limitations.

If you are working with users aged 50 to 80, provide them with a phone number and charge a subscription for the service or a one-time payment. It might be borderline exploitative, but I have noticed that elderly individuals want a "solution" rather than a lesson.

You explain how to do something, and if they are eager to learn, they will. You offer them a solution either way. Please do not create a monetization model for this custodian service and keep the charge as low as possible.

The money you receive from this serves purposes: it is designed to help them second guess and try to help themselves. If you do not charge for something, they will just keep asking you questions. When you charge for something, they perceive it to have more value compared to it being free.

Do not prioritize ease of operation that compromises their security.

gucci-on-fleek 10 minutes ago | parent

I help my grandparents out with computer stuff quite a bit, but I live far away, so I usually have to help over the phone. So having an interface that you can easily describe over the phone is pretty important to me.

When I try to sign in to most apps on my TV, it usually displays an code that you can type in on another device so that you don't have to type in a long password using the D-pad on the remote. Could you maybe implement something similar for your website? This way, my grandmother could just call and read me a code, and then I could handle the sign in remotely. As long as you only need to sign in ~once a year, this would be my preferred option.

Not all seniors have trusted friends/family who can help them, but lots do, so making it easier for the helpers will in turn make it easier for the seniors. Plus, there's no phishing risk for the senior with this method, so it's a relatively secure option too. (There is a phishing risk for the helper, but presumably they're the least vulnerable person in this scenario)

ancienthner 10 minutes ago | parent

I mean the UX is not having dementia and that's entirely another matter. I hate the idea that if you're old you can't use computers like a normal person.